Greetings - I fairly new to genealogy, so I'm hoping this forum may point me in the right direction.  I'm trying to find my great grandfather (3 times removed) from the time he 'supposedly' arrived in Australia until his death.  It seems to me he has simply fallen off the planet never to be heard of again.  I've listed below what we have been able to confirm.....

* William Moore - born circa 1820, birth certificate not found as yet

* Eleanor (Ellen) Bradley - married in Belfast, Ireland in 1850, confirmed

* Eleanor (Ellen) died in 1915 and is buried in the Williamstown Cemetery, Victoria, confirmed.  The death notice states Eleanor was a widow at the time of her death. 

* A marriage certificate for one of their daughters states William was deceased as at the time of said marriage, 1884, confirmed.

I had hoped the Archive would have records of William and Eleanor's entry/arrival into Australia, however, all of my searches haven't been successful.  I've enquired everywhere I can think of - Irish Genealogy, Victoria Records Office, Victoria BDM Dept, the list is becoming endless.  Can anyone give me any tips on where I could possibly find William?

Thank you for reading/listening..... kind regards, Penny

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Comment by Sylvia on January 30, 2020 at 14:03

I'd already mentioned that William was deceased by January 1870, so what are you looking for in those later BDM documents? N.B. His "lateness" was repeatedly confirmed in various newspaper notices:

1877 (Elizabeth’s marriage): https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/206920458?searchTerm=moore

1882 (Ellen’s marriage): https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/196706858?searchTerm=moore

1883 (Ann’s death): https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/202606356?searchTerm=rit...

etc

Comment by Penny Matson on January 30, 2020 at 14:29

I see, I saw the note, but nothing wrt a confirmed marriage certificate - thanks muchly. 

Comment by Penny Matson on January 30, 2020 at 14:36

Hi again, Sylvia, I’m sorry if I don’t understand, but the news item for Ann is for the year 1883 - and just says “daughter of the late William Moore” Of Belfast. I don’t understand how it relates to the marriage of 1870. Again, sorry, I’m not understanding. Pen

Comment by Sylvia on January 30, 2020 at 15:25

Comment by Penny Matson on January 30, 2020 at 19:41

My goodness Sylvia thank you. Obviously I have A LOT TO LEARN - clearly I’m a beginner. 

Comment by Sylvia on January 31, 2020 at 12:37

And that is why I’d mentioned that the net had to be cast wider:
With Eleanor’s 1915 death notice, I could see that she’d had (at least) 5 children. Only married names for the 4 girls (one deceased), but with this information I searched for their deaths/marriages. You’d only mentioned that William and Eleanor were married in Belfast in 1850 and that Eleanor died in Australia in 1915, so that’s a very wide timeline when searching for that elusive passenger list and William’s death. Identifying names, dates and places of births and marriages helped me to narrow that timeline.

Reg William’s death:
- The youngest child Sarah was born abt 1861/2 in Belfast, i.e. William would have still been alive early 1861. However he is listed as deceased in January 1870 when his daughter Ann marries in Belfast.
- His age was listed as 30Y when he marries in April 1850, so he would have been born abt 1819/20 (although I would not rule out earlier birth years as well) as the son of Thomas Moore.
==> William Moore would have died – most likely – in Belfast between 1861 (abt 42Y) and 1869 (abt abt 50Y).

Civil death registrations for Belfast do not have a death certificate attached (yet?), so any possibilities would have to ordered and paid for. At the moment I can’t see any good civil registration possibilities for William although I would not rule out that that William Moore who was 51Y in 1867.
As civil registration (deaths) started in the 1860’s, church records (burials) might be the way to go. Unfortunately, I have not been able to find any free online indexes for Belfast burials. I have seen some Irish pay sites come past, but I have had no experience with any of them. I have to admit that Ireland is not a country I have a lot of experience with, so there is a chance that I have overlooked a useful source. My advice is to put it aside and wait until more stuff becomes easily available. Or, maybe with more local access might read this post ...

Sylvia

Comment by Sylvia on January 31, 2020 at 12:45

BTW have you seen this item yet? (a year before they arrive in Australia)

Comment by Penny Matson on January 31, 2020 at 20:14

My goodness Sylvia.... where do you learn where to search.... CLEARLY I have so much more to learn.  I'll see about joining a genealogical group - can only be helpful !  I do have Eleanor Moore's death registration from 1915.  The children are listed on this document like this - Ann Jane (Dec'd), Jamieson Shepherd (Dec'd), Elizabeth (Aged 60), Ellen Neill (Aged 58), Sarah Isabella (Aged 53), Thomas (Dec'd) and Catherine Mary (Dec'd).  I've found the graves of Eleanor and son Jamieson - they are buried in the Williamstown Cemetery, Melbourne, Victoria as is Ellen.

Wrt to the news article..... So we see again Ellen is used instead of Eleanor ..... I'm assuming "Jamison" would be "Jamieson Shepard". So, they sold up and travelled to Australia, I'm guessing..... 

Can I ask if you know any groups near Perth W.A. that would be helpful for me to learn 'how to'?  Thanks heaps for your help Sylvia.  By the by, I've sent in a query to GRONI - some of these sites only accept a request if there is a 'death date' known - and I don't.  I've asked again, letting them know the timeline has 'dwindled' - x fingers they can help.  thanks again, Penny

Comment by Sylvia on February 5, 2020 at 18:58

I have never been a member of any genealogical groups (am mainly self taught), but maybe some of the following tips might help::

Are you aware of https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-search.jsp. A civil registration index, but also with quite a number of free images of certificates attached (mainly births and marriages)? This website might have some cheaper options than GRONI.

To be able to access many newspapers for free, become a member of your state archive and/or the National Library of Australia.

Have a look at the library websites of the various councils in your area. They will have various free subscriptions to (at least) Ancestry, FindMyPast etc.

And finally, my biggest tips: GOOGLE, GOOGLE and GOOGLE ....

Comment by Sylvia on February 5, 2020 at 19:03

PS I am not sure whether the decision to sell would have been theirs (the "owners") ...I'm interpreting it as a forced sale by their Building Society (the "petitioners")?

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