I am trying to trace my 2nd Great Grandfather James Bruce, born in 1823 in Fife, Scotland to David Bruce & Janet Kidd.

In 1847' James Bruce emigrated to Melbourne, Australia with his parents etc, they came by a ship called ' Marchioness of Douglas leaving his 1st wife Margaret Bruce and sons then got marry again to Ann Tate in 1848 in Cape of Good Hope. Ann Tate died Sept 27 1853 aged 35.

James died on 14 July 1876 at Melbourne hospital aged 53.

I am trying to trace 'Ann Tate's birth, marriage and death details but impossible to trace one?

Do you have an idea where I can trace her details?

Views: 87

Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 2, 2017 at 21:45

Pamela,  Unfortunately her death record doesn't state any parents names but it does say she was born in Yorkshire

If they married on the ship there would have been a record on the ships manifest but you would not be able to obtain any information other than that - there is no subsequent record for the marriage in Victorian records

You could try searching (Familysearch)  for her birth in Yorkshire c,1818

Digger - Pioneer Index. Victoria 1836-1888

Surname: BRUCE
Given Names: Ann
Event: Death
Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown
Spouse Gvn Names/Mother:
Age: 35
Birth Place: YORKSHIRE
Death Place:
Year: 1853
Reg Number: 467

Elizabeth

Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 2, 2017 at 21:53

Pamela,  I found this photo for Anns headstone at Fawkner Cemetery in Victoria

https://billiongraves.com/grave/Ann-Tate-Bruce/2298507#/

Elizabeth

Comment by Pamela Bruce on May 2, 2017 at 22:06
Thanks Elizabeth....I've got Ann's headstone at Fawkner Cemetery in Victoria as this as s the as not one I can find except other details? Still dnot know why Ann Tate not mentioned about her life? As you stated she's from Yorkshire whch I looked seems a Match but no further details about her background? Maybe I will need to get in touch with BMD in Yorkshire and BMD in Cape of Good Hope because her name was not on the ship with James Bruce?

Pamela
Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 2, 2017 at 22:23

Pamela,  Maybe you could try tracing the ship and see if it stopped in South Africa - I thought you meant they married on board while the ship was sailing in the Cape?

How do you know he married there - was it on some document?

Elizabeth

Comment by Debra on May 3, 2017 at 16:25

Pamela,

I cannot find a record of James BRUCE arriving on the Marchioness of Douglas, where did you see that?

Why do you think that the James BRUCE who married Margaret MORRIS in Scotland is the same person as your James BRUCE who died in Victoria?

Do you have Ann YATES' death certificate?  It was very soon after civil registration began in Victoria so it should give details of her marriage to see if it matches the information on James' death cert and will give years in the colony.

There is no such thing as 'BMD in Yorkshire'.  Civil Registration started in September 1837 and the General Register Office (GRO) indexes cover England and Wales after that date.  Perhaps you are referring to websites/groups which have indexes by county but none are as complete as the GRO indexes.  Prior to that you need to find baptisms, marriages and burials in the church registers.

Comment by Pamela Bruce on May 3, 2017 at 20:30
Debra,

James BRUCE emigrated with his parents David and Janet Bruce formerly Kidd with members of family arriving at Victoria leaves 1st wife Margaret MORRIS and three sons George BRUCE , David Anderson BRUCE and John Morris BRUCE. James BRUCE remarry Ann Tate in 1848 at Cape of Good Hope (no idea how they meet and got marry) and Margaret MORRIS remarry David SIMPSON in 1849 with the add of 3 more children Elizabeth, James and Richard.

don't think we will ever know if Margaret Morris just refused to go with him to Australia or whether he just went without asking her to go with him. I suppose in the first case he could sue her for 'desertion' and in the second she could sue him for the same. My feeling, and it's only a feeling, is that they both just ignored the fact that they were married and, thinking they would never see one another again, just went ahead and re-married.

James had a wife in Australia - an Ann Tate. She died 26 Sept 1853. I haven't managed to find out any more about her yet, like when they were married.
Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 3, 2017 at 21:01

Deb,  I couldn't find James with parents David & Janet BRUCE on the Victorian immigration indexes either but found this listing for a D BRUCE on the following site which may be David - the others are not listed

http://www.portphillipdistrict.info/Scotland_Passengers_1839-51_10.htm

maybe the record was missing so not included on the online indexes or unreadable?

Port Phillip would have been part of NSW in 1848 wouldn't it?

Elizabeth

Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 3, 2017 at 21:07

Deb/Pamela,   This might be the voyage in question but it appears the passenger list is missing - I am wondering if they paid their own way?

http://marinersandships.com.au/1848/02/034mar.htm

Elizabeth

Comment by Pamela Bruce on May 3, 2017 at 21:09
Elizabeth,

Yes would be D. Bruce along with 'Kidd' surname family? Will find Pamela t where I've seen James Bruce's name?

Pamela
Comment by Elizabeth Allen on May 3, 2017 at 21:18

Pamela,  just found Janet listed under KIDD instead of BRUCE on the 1st link I posted - I wonder why she is under her maiden name?

Elizabeth

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